Second attempt: hopefully more legible; Help with name of Lorenz Otto's father and last name of Maria Veronica

Question

[Marriage Record of Lorenz Otto and Maria Veronica ?]

Location: Winnenden, Waiblingen, Württemberg, Germany. Date: 4 May 1697.

Click here for the image details page.

Answer 1

Hey Kevin, here you go:

Transcription:

[1697] "eodem (= d.[en] 4. Maii): Lorenz Otto, Witwer u.[nd] Schreiner auch Allh.[ier]; u.[nd] Mar.[ia] Veronica, H.[errn] Jerg Binders s.[eeligen] gewes.[enen] Gerichtsverw.[andtens] zu Bakhnang, Ehl.[iche] Tochter."

Translation:

"On the same day (= May 4th 1697) [got married] Lorenz Otto, widower and carpenter, also from here; and Maria Veronica, legitimate daughter of the late Mr. Georg Binder, former council member in Backnang."

Notes: The meaning of the term "Gerichtsverwandter" varies in different regions, in rural Saxony it is used for a member of the council around the mayor. In a town in Württemberg (as Backnang is) it might well mean member of the judicial court instead. Or it is a Mixture of both. The scribe also uses the regional variation of the name "Jerg" for "Georg", it is a dialectic thing. 

Comments

Danny,

With your transcription and translation, this record becomes clear. The “H. Jerg Binders,” is now clear, with the surname Binders being underlined in the original.

Thank you.

Answer 2

This record is a challenge to read (I am unable to read much of it), and the image attached to the query seems to have the right cut off. The image on the linked profile is complete.

The record says Lorenz is a “witwer,” or widower. As such I would not expect it to name his father. The surname Otto is pretty easy to discern, and I only see it attached to Lorenz.

There is a word or name after “Mar Veronica” which seems to be underlined faintly, and if so, should be her surname. A common syntax is “bride’s given name [,] father’s given name and surname” but I don’t see that here. If her surname is given, I would not expect her father’s name.

Unfortunately, this is not much help; hopefully one of our colleagues who is more adept than I am will answer soon.

Comments

The Archion Link would be: https://www.archion.de/p/5b720095aa/

The name of the brides father is given... but I have also trouble.

eodem (same day as previous record). Lorenz Otto (groom), Witwer (widower) u. Schreiners (carpenter) ??ß allh: u. Mar. Veronica, ???chers (Bride) d. gewes. G??hts?bra?. Burkhard Sch?anes? (Brides Father), Ehl. Tochter.

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Thank yoy

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Thank you