John Kynge (John of Dodebroke)1370 -1458 & wife - Agnes(?) Mortimer (1372 -1417) need ascendancy on both

Question

- Need parentage on John Kynge (John of Dodebroke) 1370 to 1458

- Need parentage of Agnes Mortimer 1372 to 1417, John Kynge wife, birth date of Agnes maybe wrong

- Who is Alice de Mortimer Plantagenet 1343 - 1417? Is this Agnes?

Comments

Can you add the WikiTree IDs of John and Agnes?

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• John Kynge-5
• Agnes Mortimer-122
• perhaps Alice Mortimer-124

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Thanks Jim Richardson -I have followed  these referred links previously - I am really stumped as all I get is parents unknown or uncertain - don’t know where else to research . Some links suggest that John Kynge/Kinge may  possibly be the son of Henry Percy 1341 to 1407/1408 , Ist Earl of Northumberland , but I have no proof of this . I seem to have reached ‘Brick Wall’ on this one.  Thanks for your help anyway

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There is a record from 1389 of a Roger Kynge of Dodebroke, Devon.

https://www.google.co.uk/books/edition/_/cBdWAAAAMAAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&bsq=dodebroke

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Hello Victoria King.  I'm happy to help with John Kynge 1342- Feb 9, 1407 married to  Alice Mortimer. Alice is the daughter of Edmund Mortimer and Philippa daughter of  Lionel Of Antwerp, 1st Duke Of Clarence, & Elizabeth born De Burgh.   

John Kynge is the son of Nicholas Kynge, Kings or King 1310- 1393 and Judith born Heworth 1314-1341

Nicholas is the son of: Thomas Kynge, & Christena Kinge (born De Dunbar).  This is the Scottish line going back to the Earls of Dunbar and beyond.  One of his grandfathers changed the name to KING.

 

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Hi Valerie. Do you have reliable sources for what you say? 

Edmund Mortimer, husband of Philippa, is believed to have been born on 1 February 1351/2. He was under age in 1368 when Irish lands were delivered to him. I am not aware of any record that he had a daughter called Alice.

There is no good sourcing on the profiles of John Kynge-5 , his alleged wife Agnes Mortimer-122 or his alleged mother Alice Mortimer-124 . We require reliable sourcing for profiles of people born before 1700. And, as is clear from other responses to this question, there is a lot of misinformation in family trees etc on the web.

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Michael

there is a lot of confusion about the John Kings of that era.  I have several in my tree plus:

Nicholas Kinge 1310-1392 m Judith de Haworth 1314-1390?

John 1342-1407 m Alice de Mortimer born Grey

Ralph b 1390 m Phoebe Driver 1395-1452

Nicholas branches off to the Scottish line.

Hope this helps

Valerie

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I have only just started to research my King line and unfortunately entered all the ascendancy into my tree based on the book, THE KING FAMILY, compiled by Dr. G. M. G. Stafford, before documenting, as I, too, then found the problem with Agnes Mortmer.  I have found zero evidence that she is the daughter of Edmund and Phillipa, nor can I find an Alice as a daughter of Percy just checking to see if anyone has made progress with this line.

Answer 1

Here's the thing - posters need to have a pre-1500 badge to edit profiles from before 1500.  You can research them. You can add comments to the profiles summarizing your research. You can post here on G2G summarizing your research. You can ask for assistance with them. But until you're certified to edit pre-1500 profiles, what you can do with them is limited.

Answer 2

You need to start with actual sources, not the gedcom junk that's there now. Start here:

http://www.medievalgenealogy.org.uk/sources/olmed.shtml

Especially all of the links under Public records, and Heralds' Visitations.

Also:
https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/advanced-search

But there were hundreds of people named King/Kynge etcetera at any given time, many of them named John. So this particular John Kynge may be a mythical creature.

Comments

Thanks Vance , I have made contact with national archives. Gov.uk and am awaiting response. Thanks for the info, I hope I can unravel this mystery.

Answer 3

I have an ancestor Alice King/e married to Henry Baldwin. Might these Kinges be related somehow? I am actually working on these ancestors' profiles as they have needed some 'clean up'.

https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Kinge-78

Answer 4

The Descendants view of Alice Mortimer shows nine people including her. None of these have any sources attached except broken links to Ancestry trees. Alice is indicated as uncertain existence, but whoever added that has not stated why. Her daughter-in-law Agnes has a long text explaining how she could not be the daughter of the parents previously attached to her.

You need to start with the latest generation, Ralph Kynge and work back from him. But even that will be hard as he is said to have been born and died in Offchurch, Shropshire and there is no such place. His father was apparently born in Ugborough Devon, and his grandfather in Hertfordshire, and the previous generations in Reading, Berkshire and Dodebroke, Devon. That's a rather scattered set of places. If they even existed, it looks to me like random people called King have been wrongly linked together.

Comments

I suppose it must mean Offchurch, Warwick. But I agree that it looks like a miscellany of people named King cobbled together.