Declaration of Arbroath Connection Combat: Robert the Bruce vs Edward Longshanks

Question

Our Connection Combat this week honors the Declaration of Arbroath of 6 April 1320, Scotland's declaration of independence. On the one side we have Robert the Bruce, declared King of Scotland, and on the other we have King Edward I of England, known as "Longshanks".

Here's how the game is played:

1. Check your connection to Robert the Bruce and Edward Longshanks (click "Connection to Me" in each profile pull-down menu).
2. Click "Answer this post" below. Choose Team Bruce  or Team Longshanks and say how many degrees are in your chosen connection path.
3. See if you can verify each relationship along your connection path with a reliable source [more explanation].
4. Post comments below your answer as you progress and when you run into trouble. Someone else might be able to help.

The players with the closest verified connection wins!

There are seven additional ways to win and enter the Connection Combat Hall of Fame. These require clearing your path of any and all little "WikiTree Weevils."

This game runs from April 2-9. 

Do you want to help others? We call this "combat" just for fun. It's really more about collaboration than competition. Please participate in your team's Aid Station and stop by when you have questions or problems.

• Team Bruce Aid Station
• Team Longshanks Aid Station

You can also chat live on Discord. See the Connection Combat help page for more information.

Comments

P.S. Share the , spread the word!

• Facebook: Link
• Twitter: Link
• Mastodon: Link
• Instagram: Link
• YouTube: video 
  
  Plantagenet-2
• TikTok: Link

Answer 1

Oh this is a tough one for me! I'm 24 degrees from both. Longshanks is supposedly my 22nd great-grandfather so I should probably go with him BUT..... I really like Robert the Bruce so I will be Team Bruce! There's only one marriage in the connection path and there's some family there I'm not familiar with so it will be fun to explore.

Comments

21° from me

---

Yup, me too just the same. It's a journey not a destination, but... damn the Normans, huzzah Team Bruce!

---

Robert the Bruce is my second Cousin 24 times removed I think.

---

I'm 23 from Longshanks but only 22 from Robert the Bruce. Of course I'm on team Bruce.

Answer 2

Oh this is my favorite! They're both (uncertain) 21GGF for me, through different lines.

Comments

Exciting!

---

Me, too.  Edward on Dad's side.  Robert the Bruce on Mother's side.  

But, I've always been on Robert the Bruce side---long before I knew of being related.  I am sooooo excited to have him as an ancestor.  I thought it would be from the Bruces (also in my line) but. . . .it popped up in my Barron---Armstrong line.

Answer 3

Well, this should be fun. Robert the Bruce is my 20th great grandfather and Edward Plantagenet is my 21st great grandfather. Will check to see which will work best.

Team King Edward I of England (Longshanks)

0. Edward I Plantagenet
1. Edmund Plantagenet (his son)
2. Joan Plantagenet (his daughter)
3. Thomas Holland (her son)
4. Margaret Holland (his daughter)
5. Joan Beaufort (her daughter)
6. John Stewart (her son)
7. John Stewart (his son)
8. John Stewart (his son)
9. Barbara Stewart (his daughter)
10. Alexander Menzies (her son)
11. William Menzies (his son)
12. Robert Menzies (his son)
13. Duncan Menzies (his son)
14. Elizabeth Menzies (his daughter)
15. Margrate Stewart (her daughter)
16. William Caraway (her son)
17. Robert Caraway (his son)
18. John Caraway (his son)
19. Mary Caraway (his daughter)
20. Oscar Bryan (her son)
21. Marie Bryan (his daughter - my grandmother)
22. Mac Adams (her son - my father)
23. Me

Comments

Oh nice! That's cool.

---

It was interesting. Went with Longshanks even though I'm a big Robert the Bruce fan.

---

I'm 21granddaughter and 21granddaughter but will always choose Robert the Bruce!

Answer 4

21 degrees Robert the Bruce (20th great grandfather)
23 degrees King Edward I (21st great grandfather) 

So go Team Bruce! FREEEEEEDOMMMMMM!

0. Robert Bruce
1. Marjorie Bruce (his daughter)
2. Robert II Stewart (her son)
3. John Stewart (his son)
4. Margaret Stewart (his daughter)
5. Alexander Robertson (her son)
6. Alexander Robertson (his son)
7. Janet Robertson (his daughter)
8. Duncan Campbell (her son)
9. Margaret Ogilvy (his wife)
10. Sibilla Ogilvy (her daughter)
11. David Falconer (her son)
12. Alexander Falconer (his son)
13. Alexander Falconer (his son)
14. Charity Falconer (his daughter)
15. Nancy Barnes (her daughter)
16. Eliza Mount (her daughter)
17. Arthur Howell (her son)
18. James Howell (his son)
19. Elmer Sayers-Howell (his son)
20. Larry Sayers-Howell (his son)
21. Shonda Sayers-Howell (his daughter)

My shortest line to Robert has 2 branches. My direct line is 23 degrees - so I opted for the shortest line.

Answer 5

Team Edward I Plantagenet, Plantagenet-2 is 23 degrees from Robert Bruce, King Robert 1st of Scots:

0. Edward I Plantagenet, Plantagenet-2, 21st great grandfather, mrca Plantagenet-167, Provence-162

1. his son, Edward II Plantagenet (Plantagenet) of England, Plantagenet-378, 20th great-granduncle, mrca Castilla-85, Plantagenet-2

2. his daughter, Joan (Plantagenet) Queen of Scots, Plantagenet-581, 1st c, 21r, mrca Castilla-85, Plantagenet-2

3. her husband, David II (Bruce) King of Scots, Bruce-510, 2nd c, 20r, mrca Clare-18, Bruce-517

23 Degrees David II King of Scots, Bruce-510

0. David II (Bruce) King of Scots, Bruce-510

1. his wife, Plantagenet-581

2. her brother, Plantagenet-70

3. his son, Plantagenet-66

4. his daughter, Beaufort-1

5. her daughter, Neville-219

6. her daughter, York-1211

7. her daughter, St_Leger-32

8. her daughter, Manners-17

9. her son, Constable-59

10. his daughter, Constable-58

11. her son, Stapleton-52

12. his daughter, Stapleton-51

13. her son, Nelson-696

14. his daughter, Nelson-4898

15. her husband, Colburn-84

16. his brother, Coburn-101

17. his son, Coburn-618

18. his daughter, Coburn-624

19. her son, Wheeler-18871

20. his son, Wheeler-18812

21. his son, Wheeler-18807

22. his son, Wheeler-18911

23. his daughter, Wheeler-18799

4. his father, Robert (Bruce) Bruce King Robert 1st of Scots, Bruce-129

Team Edward I Plantagenet, Plantagenet-2, 21st great grandfather one branch (24) versus Robert (Bruce) Bruce King Robert 1st of Scots, Bruce-129, 1st c, 21r, one branch (25).

23 degrees Edward Edward I, Plantagenet-2, 21st great grandfather, one branch (24),  his daughter Joan Plantagenet, Plantagenet-181

0. Edward 1 Plantagenet, Plantagenet-2

1. his daughter, Joan Plantagenet-181

2. her daughter, Clare-613

3. her daughter, Audley-130

4. her daughter, Stafford-34

5. her daughter, Ros-30

6. her daughter, Grey-370

7. her daughter, Bonville-28

8. her son, Tailboys-39

9. his daughter, Tailboys-2

10. her daughter, Tyrwhit-8

11. her daughter, Thimbleby-2

12. her son, Welby-4

13. his daughter Olive Welby, Welby-8, Olive Welby, Gateway Ancestor, Descendant of Magna Carta Surety Baron Saher de Quincy, Quincy-226, Olive (Welby) Farwell migrated to New England during the Puritan Great Migration (1621-1640)

14. her daughter, Farwell-69

15. her daughter, Bates-2239

16. her daughter, Richardson-6924

17. her son, Coburn-618

18. his daughter, Coburn-624

19. her son, Wheeler-18871

20. his son, Wheeler-18812

21. his son, Wheeler-18807

22. his son, Wheeler-18911

23. his daughter, Wheeler-18799
 

 23 degrees Edward I Plantagenet, Plantagenet-2

0. Edward I Plantagenet, Plantagenet-2

1. his son, Plantagenet-99

2. his daughter, Plantagenet-85

3. her daughter, Segrave-1

4. her daughter, Mowbray-3

5. her daughter, Welles-222

6. her husband, Hilton-522

7. his son, Hilton-718

8. his daughter, Hilton-716

9. her son, Thimbleby-4

10. his son, Thimbleby-3

11. his daughter, Thimbleby-2

12. her son, Welby-4

13. his daughter, Olive Welby, Welby-8, Olive Welby, Magna Carta Gateway Ancestor, Descendant of Magna Carta Surety Baron Saher de Quincy, Quincy-226, Olive (Welby) Farwell migrated to New England during the Puritan Great Migration )1621-1640)

14. her daughter, Farwell-69

15. her daughter, Bates-2239

16. her daughter, Richardson-6924

17. her son, Coburn-618

18. his daughter, Coburn-624

19. her son, Wheeler-18871

20. his son, Wheeler-18812

21. his son, Wheeler-18807

22. his son, Wheeler-18911

23. his daughter, Wheeler-18799

23 degrees Robert the Bruce, Bruce-129, 1c, 21r, one branch (25), his father, Robert Bruce, Bruce-3176

0. Robert Bruce, Bruce-129

1. his father, Bruce-3176

2. his sister, Brus-127

3. her daughter, FitzMarmaduke-6

4. her son, Lumley-44

5. his son, Lumley-654

6. his son, Lumley-45

7. his daughter, Lumley-132

8. her son, Tyrwhitt-5

9. his son, Tyrwhitt-8

10. his son, Tyrwhit-4

11. his daughter, Tyrwhit-8

12. her daughter, Thimbleby-2

13. her son, Welby-4

14. his daughter, Olive Welby, Welby-8, Olive Welby Magna Carta Gateway Ancestor, Descendant of Magna Carta Surety Baron Saher de Quincy, Quincy-226, Olive (Welby) Farwell migrated to New England during the Puritan Great Migration (1621-1640)

15. her daughter, Farwell-69

16. her daughter, Bates-2239

17. her daughter, Richardson-6924

18. her son, Coburn-618

19. his daughter, Coburn-624

20. her son, Wheeler-18871

21. his son, Wheeler-18812

22. his son, Wheeler-18807

23. his son, Wheeler-18911

24. his daughter, Wheeler-18799

Twenty-three degrees Robert Bruce King Robert 1st of Scots. Bruce-129

0. Bruce-129

1. his daughter, Bruce-124

2. her son, Stewart-1001

3. his son, Stewart-972

4. his daughter, Stewart-1638

5. her daughter, Douglas-387

6. her daughter, Forbes-124

7. her son, Irvine-1467

8. his son, Irvine-1468

9. his son, Irvine-1200

10. his daughter, Irvine-1199

11. her son, Johnston-909

12. his son, Johnson-2045

13. his son, Johnson-2021

14. his daughter, Johnson-7908

15. her husband, Crowder-328

16. his brother, Crowder-662

17. his son, Crowder-2654

18. his son, Crowder-2603

19. his daughter, Crowder-2005

20. her daughter, Morrison-13595

21. her daughter, West-18061

22. her son. Wheeler-18911

23. his daughter, Wheeler-18799

Answer 6

This one is hard because there are so many sketchy and/or fictional connections to those two.

I show as 22 degrees from Robert the Bruce, but that is line has a connection that is unverifiable, and probably wrong.

I show as 23 degrees from Edward, but I fear running that line would be an exercise in disconnecting/dismissing speculative relationships rather than verifying true ones.

Comments

In my case, the Robert the Bruce line is longer and uncertain. I guess one could say doubtful, or, as you do, probably wrong. The connection, on the other hand, was through a wife, and thus, not direct, trough the inlaw.

The "Longshanks" line works well enough, but who knows how many lineages could potentially dissolve into thin air given vigorous scrutiny of their DNA connections. Hanky panky, after all, and mistakes, happen.

Answer 7

Awkward. At 21 degrees from Robert the Bruce and 22 degrees from Edward I Plantagenet, you'd think Team Bruce would have it, but...and long but, Edward I is my 20th great grandfather while Robert Bruce is my 22nd great grandfather so I'm calling that, too close to call.

0. Robert Bruce

1. Marjorie Bruce (his daughter)

2. Robert II Stewart (her son)

3. Elizabeth Stewart (his daughter)

4. Gilbert Hay (her son)

5. Gilbert Hay (his son)

6. Walter Hay (his son)

7. William Hay (his son)

8.Margaret Hay (his daughter)

9. George Johnston (her son)

10. William Johnston (his son)

11. Elizabeth Johnston (his daughter)

12. Ann Keith (her daughter)

13, Jacob Walker (her son)

14. Courtenay Tucker (his wife)

15. Robert Tucker (her brother)

16. Martha Tucker (his daughter)

17. Richard Gregory (her son)

18. Thomas Gregory (his son)

19. Lucille Gregory (his daughter)

20. Irene Blair (her daughter)

21. Frank Blankenship (her son)

  ****

0. Edward I Plantagenet

1. Thomas Plantagenet (his son)

2. Margaret Plantagenet (his daughter)

3. Elizabeth Segrave (her daughter)

4. Thomas Mowbray (her son)

5. Isabel Mowbray (his daughter)

6. Maurice Berkeley (her son)

7. James Berkeley (his son)

8. Mary Berkeley (his daughter)

9. Henry Johnes (her son)

10. Thomas Johnes (his son)

11. Elizabeth Johnes (his daughter)

12. John Awbrey (her son)

13. John Awbrey (his son)

14. Chandler Awbrey (his son)

15. Martha Awbrey (his daughter)

16. Elizabeth Pendleton (her daughter)

17. Joseph Motley (her son)

18. Daniel Edward Motley (his son)

19. Emily Motley (his daughter)

20. John Blair (her son)

21. Irene Blair (his daughter)

22. Frank Blankenship (her son)

Answer 8

I'm one degree closer to Robert the Bruce, and honestly how could I not choose the cause of national liberation?
(But that's not a discussion for G2G!)

We'll see if I can find more time to really participate this week. Otherwise perhaps I'll at least do some tidying that will help the cause!

Answer 9

Team Bruce all the way!

23 degrees from Bruce- 21st great grandfather

24 degrees from Longshanks *ewwww*- 22nd great grandfather.

Comments

I felt the same way!

---

I do admit I'm not fond of England and their history, hence the ewwww. Just nasty ugly history.

---

I feel the same way about English history, and that is why I am so glad I'm 1% more Scottish than I am English. Lol. They are my top two ethnicities and Scotland just beats England by a hair! But I'll take it! They fought so hard through the years for liberation.

---

LOL you are so right about that. When I saw that I was related to the Longshanks... the shame. Oh... the shame with a little throw up in my mouth. :(

Answer 10

All of these people are fairly similarly close to me, all 28-31 degrees. But Edward I beats Robert the Bruce, 29 to 30 degrees.

Updated to match a new connection on my end!

Answer 11

24 degrees each but for Longshanks is direct at 24 degrees. Team Longshanks for me, completed.

Answer 12

Edward I: 20th GGF. (22°)
Robert the Bruce: 2ndCousin, 21 removed. (23°)
Same uncertainty person through both lines.

Answer 13

20th great granddaughter to Bruce
22nd great granddaughter to Longshanks

1. Azure is the daughter of Frances (Peasley) Robinson 
2. Frances is the daughter of Francis Lynden Peasley (1907-2002) 
3. Francis is the son of Mary Etta (Ames) Peasley (1880-1925) 
4. Mary is the daughter of George Hamilton Ames (1851-1926) 
5. George is the son of Eliza Jane (Paul) Greer (1833-1926) [confident]
6. Eliza is the daughter of Rachel Margaret (Elrod) Paul (abt.1811-1878) [confident]
7. Rachel is the daughter of Thomas H Elrod (abt.1767-abt.1847) [unknown confidence]
8. Thomas is the son of Mary (Muse) Elrod (1729-1828) [confident]
9. Mary is the daughter of William Muse (1701-1749) [confident]
10. William is the son of John Muse Jr. (abt.1673-abt.1723) [unknown confidence]
11. John is the son of John Muse Sr. (bef.1633-1723) [unknown confidence]
12. John is the son of Margery (Aucocke) Mewes (1588-1663) [unknown confidence]
13. Margery is the daughter of Isobel Agnes Wilsonne (1568-abt.1610) [unknown confidence]
14. Isobel is the daughter of Kristhen Meldrome (1545-1620) [unknown confidence]
15. Kristhen is the daughter of Margaret Leslie (abt.1511-1587) [unknown confidence]
16. Margaret is the daughter of George (Leslie) Leslie Fourth Earl of Rothes (abt.1484-1558) [confident]
17. George is the son of Margaret Balfour (bef.1471-1518) [confident]
18. Margaret is the daughter of Janet Ogilvy (abt.1430-abt.1500) [unknown confidence]
19. Janet is the daughter of Marjorie (Glen) Ogilvy (abt.1390-abt.1450) [unknown confidence]
20. Marjorie is the daughter of John Glen (abt.1359-abt.1410) [unknown confidence]
21. John is the son of Margaret (Bruce) Glen (abt.1300-abt.1370) [unknown confidence]
22. Margaret is the daughter of Robert (Bruce) Bruce King Robert Ist of Scots (1274-1329) [unknown confidence]

Comments

Yeah, I'm also purportedly a 20th Great Granddaughter of Bruce and a 22nd Great Granddaughter of Longshanks.

Answer 14

Mine shows

Robert the Bruce - 19th Great-grandfather, 21 degrees

Longshanks - 21st Great-grandfather, 23 degrees

Comments

me too same same

---

Howdy, 13th cousin, once removed!  

---

Aloha Coz

Answer 15

Robert the Bruce is 22nd great grandfather, Longshanks is 23 great grandfather, with a couple Kennedy questions.

Since my father's family is from Scotland, Ireland and England, it's probably semi accurate.

Answer 16

I'm 25 degrees from both through the same person, but she is connected through a connection that I have practically disproved through old estate records.  I didn't think I was connection to either.

Answer 17

This is a great one. I am Team Bruce and Team Longshanks - both are 26 degrees. Those shorter connections have relations by marriage I've never seen before. I have longer, better-documented connections to each through my Maryland gateway ancestors (Mainwaring, Gill). FREEDOM!

Answer 18

They were both one of my 21st great grandfathers! I can not choose!

Comments

Team Bruce!!! LOL

Answer 19

Edward l Plantagenet 2 (6th cousins 19 times removed)

Robert Bruce - King Robert lst of Scots (7th cousins 19 times removed).

Answer 20

Team Bruce. Robert the Bruce is my 20th great grandfather and Edward Plantagenet is my 22nd great grandfather.