BARTRUM WELSH GENEALOGIES ONLINE AT GENI.COM

Question

Previously Peter Bartrum’s Welsh Genealogies AD 300-1400 (8 volumes) and Welsh Genealogies AD 1400-1500 (18 volumes) were available on the CADAIR website. That website was deleted which resulted in broken links on WikiTree profiles.

 Aberystwyth University digitized the published works and the unpublished emendments at this site: https://research.aber.ac.uk/en/datasets/bartrum-genealogical-project - Aberystwyth University Bartrum Genealogical Project. Unfortunately, each page is on a separate .png file grouped under .zip folders. There is no way to search the material. Several inquiries to the staff requesting information on how to use the material were not answered.

 Fortunately, cousin Liz Shifflett found the Bartrum’s works while doing a Google search for a Welsh surname. Geni.com, owned by MyHeritage, obtained permission to copy the Aberystwyth project. It is still presented on individual page files but now there is a table of contents and indices allowing the material to be searched and easily copied. See https://www.geni.com/projects/Bartrum-Genealogical-Project/4476525 - Geni – Bartrum Genealogical Project

 Full access is free and available after registration on Geni.com.

 COPYRIGHT: The copyright status on both websites is CC BY – free to use or modify with attribution – https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/ - Creative Commons Attribution 4.0 International (CC BY 4.0).

Comments

Thanks for posting Stuart! Wanted to share a discovery I just made: Selecting the "View Full Size" option for the chart & then copying that URL to the profile as a link results in a database error (Error 966: Link error various). To fix it, replace the URL with the one you get when you first open the chart (go back to the Geni project's index & open the chart again to get it - I didn't see a short cut for getting to that URL from the one that doesn't work).

Answer 1

I just saw this on my daily newsfeed and remembered that my step-mothers family had the name Berttram in it.  I'm not sure if it's just a spelling variation or not.

Answer 2

Please be very circumspect in using Bartrum as a source. As stated previously there are a number of errors.
In http://www.ancientwalesstudies.org/id139.html Darrell Woolcott examines these, and critiques Bartrum's work.
Although some people have disagreed with Woolcott, he is, currently, one of the best authorities on Ancient Wales.
The Woolcott Source in Ap_Llywarch-14 shows the sort of work that is produced by ancientwalesstudies.org
http://www.ancientwalesstudies.org/id240.html

Comments

A footnote from ancientwalesstudies.org

Peter Bartrum's "Welsh Genealogies AD 300-1400", 8 volumes published 1974 (sources are provided for individual names, but assembling names into family charts was often poorly handled, so conflations and generation gaps are extensive)                               

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Further reading - http://www.ancientwalesstudies.org/id70.html

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See WT Pre-1500 Resource page regarding Bartrum - https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Space:Pre-1500_Resource_Page#Quality_Websites_-_Use_with_Caution

Answer 3

Thanks Stuart! This is a simpler way of accessing Peter Bartrum’s research than downloading all the zip files from Aberystwyth University’s website.

When fixing broken links, is there a consensus about whether we should add a link to Geni, or to the original repository on Aberystwyth University’s website, or both? I have been adding links to original repository because I wasn’t sure how permanent and stable the Geni links would be.

Peter Bartrum’s work is an excellent starting point when researching medieval Wales. However, like all genealogists, his conclusions are only as good as the sources he cites -- many of which are manuscripts written in the 16th century, rather than records created at the time the people lived.

He has carefully cited his sources, which is a big help in tracking down the original sources. Thankfully, the National Library of Wales is digitising some of the original records he has cited and makes them freely available on their website. The ones I have found so far are:

• Peniarth MS 127 (Llyfr Syr Thomas ap Ieuan ap Deicws, written abt 1510-1544). Source "G" on Bartrum's list of sources.

• Peniarth MS 128 (Llyfr Edward ap Roger, 16th century). Source "H" in Bartrum's list.

• a transcript of Rhandiroedd Powys (the earliest extant version is dated 1493), NLW Journal, vol. 18, p. 231-7. Source "RP" in Bartrum's list.

Bartrum also cited a number of other Peniarth manuscripts and the National Library of Wales has plans to digitise the entire Peniarth manuscript collection. Anyone interested can read more here.

Comments

Thanks for your comment and for the update on Bartrum’s sources.

 The idea of citing both has appeal. I am not sure how this is different than two different sources for a digitized book.

 The usability of the Aberystwyth is a major deterrent.

 Yes, Geni might disappear or the Bartrum Project on it.

 Who would have thought Aberystwyth U would have eliminated their CADAIR site, and its Bartrum Project info, without a link to the new web site?