One son ... or two ... or none ... or WHAT?????

+6 votes
243 views

I made a huge breakthrough on Kasriel Movsha Grek (who I think is probably related to my great grandmother, but I'm trying to figure out how) when I found that his mother came to the United States and "her son" was listed on her immigration record as her contact here).  

After frenzied searching, I managed to find that Kasriel Movsha came to the United States from Lithuania in 1911.  The key was discovering that his name in the United States was Morris Goldberg and he lived in North Carolina (everyone else in my family who came here stayed in New York).  

Now I'm very confused by his children and appealing for help to figure them out.

Lithuanian records show twins, Freida and Khana, born 1903, but no other children.  1920 United States census shows daughter Fannie, age 17, who I'm sure is Freida.  It also shows son Joseph, age 7, who was born in United States.

The problem that has me stumped now is the United States marriage record I found for J M Goldberg (in North Carolina with the right parents).  I figured he was Joseph, until I looked at the dates.  He was married in 1925 at age 24, when Joseph would have only been 11 years old.

I have not found any records showing a male child born in Lithuania, nor can I find any other United States records showing Joseph.  All records I have found are on the profiles for him and his daughter Freida/Fannie.

HELP, PLEEEZ!

WikiTree profile: Morris Goldberg
in Genealogy Help by Gaile Connolly G2G Astronaut (1.2m points)

1 Answer

+1 vote

Two anomalies strike me:

  • The 1920 census entry for Joseph is confusing, as it says he and his mother were born in North Carolina, but from the other evidence you present Morris and Celia had been married since 1898, and she is shown as born in Russia. Is there an error in this 1920 record?
  • In the 1908 revision list Kasrel Movsha is not living with his wife and daughters. Why? Where are they? Or is this the wrong man in 1908?
You have an immigration year but not a passenger list. It would be worth searching for this in case it includes more clues. If there was a son born in Lithuania he would probably appear with the rest of the family there.
by Andrew Millard G2G6 Pilot (122k points)
Thank you for looking into this, Andrew.  

The 1920 census shows only Joseph as born in the US - father, mother, and sister are all shown as born in Russia (that's what most US records show for people from countries that were part of the Russian Empire).  

That census record is where I got the information about the family's immigration year.  I searched for the immigration record, using a wide variety of names for all three of them, but could not find any.  You sure are right about finding clues on immigration records - the only way I found this family in the United States to begin with was because his mother's immigration record said she was going to her son in North Carolina - didn't even have the son's name.

I've worked a lot with family records in the Lithuanian revision lists and they are often very strange.  I don't think we can tell if the family members shown in a list were all living in the same household. Often adult children in their father's household also have spouse and children shown in the list, but other times there are separate family lists for them.  In this particular family list, there are other adult children included, who also were married and had children and are known to have been living in a different town.

The "J M" who was married in 1925 would have been a year older than the twins, but the only children's birth records I found were the twins and I didn't find a death record, either in Lithuania or the United States for the twin who is missing from the United States records.  This, too, often happens - I only find Lithuanian birth records for some of the children, yet I find others on family lists, marriage or death records.  I gather that records there are a patchwork, with events that are sometimes recorded and other times not.  It is VERY frustrating!
Follow the line for Joseph in the 1920 census across the page. The columns for father's birthplace and language are Russia and Hebrew, the columns for mother's birthplace and language are South Carolina and blank. That is the anomaly, which suggests to me there may be an error here.

I had not noticed that before, but it must be the error because the line for his mother shows Russia and gives the immigration year.

The mess just got even worse.  I had not looked at Celia's find a grave page before, but now I see the following on it:

Three Children all born in Russia:
Anna b. 15 Mar 1899
Jacob b. 31 Aug 1902
Fanny b. 20 Dec? 1903
Celia was naturalized in 1922

It looks like the "J M" who was married in 1925 was Jacob, but now there's also another child I didn't know about - Anna - and Fanny's twin isn't mentioned, nor is Joseph who was born in the US.

I'm going to now look for records for Jacob.

I found 1 record for Jacob, a 1920 census that shows him living as a boarder in a North Carolina home, but nothing in Lithuania and no immigration record.

I'm also thinking that the Anna shown in her mother's find a grave record is probably Khana, but the find a grave record says she was born 1899 and Khana's birth record in Lithuania shows that she and Freida were both born May 13, 1903.  It looks like whoever gave the information in the find a grave record was confused about dates - Fannie/Freida's birth date is shown as "Dec 20? 1903".

I wouldn't assume that the error is in the mother's birthplace. As they are in North Carolina, South Carolina is an odd mistake. I could understand if it had been North Carolina as that appears so frequently in that column for other households, but South Carolina seems more likely to be intentional. The census does not explicitly state that Celia is Joseph's mother, only that M is his father and M is married to Celia. Is it possible that the relationship to M is wrong? (nephew? grandson? adopted son?)

Ancestry has North Carolina Naturalizations index which shows a Morris Goldberg with wife Celia in 1922, but I don't have a subscription to look at the full record. It may name children naturalized at the same time.

The gravestones seem to give Hebrew names of

  • Katriel Moshe ben Yoel 
  • Tziriel bat Ya'acov

Those Hebrew names on the gravestones are incredible - they absolutely cement the connection between the United States Morris and Celia and the Lithuania Kazriel Movsha and Tzirie!

I have been chasing down Joseph (the elusive J M marriage record) and found another crazy puzzle.  In addition to that 1925 marriage, there is a 1935 New York marriage record for Jacob Goldberg and Evelyn Nicholson that shows his father as Morris and mother as Celia Shain (the correct maiden name for Celia).  Later records show him as Jack (sometimes Jack M), and they had a few children, born in North Carolina and Georgia.  The problem is his Pennsylvania obituary, that names him Jack E and shows he had brothers David and Morris.  I made Jacob's profile HERE and put all the sources I found in it, but there are definitely big questions about whether he is conflated with a second person.

Full obit for Jack Goldberg here https://www.legacy.com/amp/obituaries/philly/129836 This doesn't look right to me with children Michael and Ivy and none of those named in the 1950 census.

The related SSDI entry here https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:VMRD-WTG says born 1925, so certainly not the one in the 1935 marriage.
Yes, I noticed the 1925 birth date in several of the Jack E records, but that's just 1 more conflict added to the pot because his wife is shown as Evelyn, who is from Pennsylvania in most of the Jack E records.  The 1935 marriage record shows bride Evelyn from Pennsylvania.

I posted a question asking for ancestry lookup of the naturalization records you found and had a response from Jim Lamson, who said he will send them to me.
FamilySearch suggested the NUMIDENT file as a matching record to the SSDI https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:6K38-N1PN This is definitely Jack E and has the wrong parents and birthplace for the one you are tracing. I think it is just a coincidence that the two Jacks have wives called Evelyn from Pennsylvania.

Jack E Goldberg married in Philadelphia 1950 ref. 855912 https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:JV4T-9B4 to Evelyn G Daroff ref. 855912 https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:JVQC-B4H
Grrrrr ... it's soooo frustrating having to deal with all the conflicts and filter out all the different people with similar names and places.  THANX for putting this one to rest for good!

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