mtDNA Test Results Back - overwhlemed with the amount of information...Suggestions?

+26 votes
4.2k views
I got my results back.  I had no problem entering the information into WikiTree at all.  Thanks for making that so easy.

So I have looked in the list to see if any one on WikiTree shares my Haplogroup - H1b1 in general and of the non-private results listed there are two.  My Haplogroup is actually H1b1-T16362c which according to Family Tree DNA is only 5% of the H Haplogroup.

On FamilyTree DNA I have matches, though no closer than a difference of 2.  On MitoSearch I have many which are a difference of 0.

Do I now contact those that are zero and see where we cross? Craziness!

Mags
WikiTree profile: Mags Gaulden
in The Tree House by Mags Gaulden G2G6 Pilot (650k points)
retagged by Ellen Smith
I have gone through the Cluster most distant relatives list from FTDNA (16) and looked for them on WikiTree - I have one or two possible, maybe kind of sorta...
I have one of my peeps most distant relative listed as Unknown Flaggstaff AR Adopted.  Hmm.  I guess they might like to know about me?
(Mags, I'd suggest leaving off one of the surname tags for now and tagging it with DNA instead. That way our knowledgeable DNA members will be more likely to see this post!)
Thank you so much little elf!

7 Answers

+6 votes
You may not have the correct results in MitoSearch.  You note your haplogroup is H1b1.  In MitoSearch you say your results are the rCRS.  H1b1 does not match the rCRS. The rCRS is in haplogroup H2a2a.

On your myFTDNA page, under your mtDNA results there is upload button to MitoSearch.  Using that button makes it easier to upload your results to MitoSearch without data entry errors.

Sincerely, Peter
by Peter Roberts G2G6 Pilot (718k points)

Another person who belongs to your haplogroup H1b1-T16362c has the following differences from the rCRS:

On HVR1: A16129G, T16187C, C16189T, T16223C, G16230A, T16278C, C16311T, T16356C, T16362C
 
On HVR2: G73A, C146T, C195T, A247G, 315.1C
 
If you belong to H1b1 then your differences from the rCRS should be somewhat similar.  The first letter A, T, C, etc. can be dropped because sometimes "A16129G" is reported as "16129G"
Thnaks very much Peter.  It took me a couple of tries to upload my results from FamilyTree DNA to mitosearch.  I got a few error messages before it appeared to have worked.  I guess it didn't and I should go back and enter my info by hand.  

I just looked over my results compared to those I should be close to and I am - though it was on the RSRS values not the rCRS values.

Mags
AND I have entered my results into Mitosearch by hand.  It makes a huge difference!  thanks so much Peter.  Mags
In MitoSearch you match F67U8 who identifies their earliest direct maternal line ancestor as Mlinda or Matilda Cook b. abt 1822 in Mississippi.  This match is on HVR1&2.

You have about 50 exact matches on HVR1 (who have not tested HVR2).  Some of their direct maternal line origins may provide clues to the ancestry of your earliest known direct maternal ancestor.
I was a half step ahead of you on this one Peter!  I have already emailed them AND I think I may have found her profile on WikiTree...waiting for replies now.  Do you have any spiffy thing you can do for me on that?  :-)  Mags
+9 votes
Rather than starting another thread...

I ran a report for FMS HVR1 and HVR2 on FTDNA and thought I would see a list with some 0 difference - I have seen results at 0 from FTDNA on Mitosearch.  All I get are 2's and 3's.  Am I missing something?  Do I have to purchase the Family finder feature for another $100 to get that report?

On the bright side...When I run just HVR1 I get a list of 0's - with other haplo groups listed that I know from cousins, that I am associated with on the Y!  Yes!  Now we are cooking with gas!

Mags
by Mags Gaulden G2G6 Pilot (650k points)
AND the answer is...drumroll...I have to buy the Family Finder to have advanced information.  Thank goodness I got the original test at a reduced price!

Ok.  

Mags
+9 votes
I am having difficulty making sense out of the results of my dna test too. Are you finding any information on the Wilburns (and various spellings)?
by Doris Smith G2G6 Mach 1 (16.1k points)

Yes and yes and yes. :-)

The mtDNA test did prove my connection to the Welborn/Wilbrun family. I have also used it to prove my line back to Ann Unknown Hall. I am trying to get other cousins to test so we can hopefully knock down the  brickwall that is Ann Hall .

In general I haven't gotten very far with any of my mtDNA matches (others than the ones listed above and I found them) as it seems they aren't as interested as I am. One will come round, I am sure.

I did get an atDNA test done and it has been one incredible match after another and lots of proven stuff via triangulation.

You are only on 23andMe or at least that is the only thing you have listed for your DNA. You can upload your DNA file to GEDmatch and it will give you more opportunities for matches. It's quick and easy to do: Register for an account at GEDmatch.com then on your profile page fo over to the right and scroll down to Upload From 23andMe Qcuick and Easy. Clcik it and you will be taken to 23andMe, sign in and the transfer will go through. Right off the bat you will be able to compare us (my GEDmatch is on my profile page). After a day or so you can run a query between you and many and so on.

Be great to see the match for us!

Mags

Good luck!

Mags

 

Hi Mags,

I'm confused about your tagging of her (list of DNA descendants: http://www.wikitree.com/treewidget/Unknown-255103/890) as proven through DNA.

I don't see any other DNA test that proves this. Isn't it necessary to have other DNA tests (at least for atDNA we do need to have a triangulated group).

As certain as the naming of a mother usually is (at least in modern times when births happened at the hospital) I wouldn't be so sure about former times when births happened at home and there might still be a NME (non maternal event) being possible. Like an underaged sister that got pregnant from another farmer boy and the official mother in all documents was her older sister? Just an example, I'm pretty sure these cases happened.

So even as this is obviously a relatively proven way (given mother's are almost always named on birth certificates - I think about Sir Richard Branson's Indian ancestor that wasn't named), what is the agreed way on WikiTree for "confirmed by DNA"?

Otherwise I can follow and mark also all of my maternal line as proven.

What's the case for Y-DNA? NPE's happen 2.5- 3.5% of all times (or births). Are we assuming a paper trail is correct and enter "proven by DNA" as well?

Looking forward to all of your views and comments!
Hey Andreas,

Not all of the people who were included in the triangulation are members of WikiTree so you wouldn't see their tests listed.

Mags
All the more we need some sort of template that helps us track those sources and evidence as every visitor will question those "proven by DNA" as long as the evidence isn't stated along.

Again, instead of wasting time with manually correcting people from wrong categories we could do so much more needed (and helpful) work.

Mags, you have put already so much effort into the explanation & help pages for "proven by DNA", do you want to make another effort to streamline the insights of our WeeTee's and come up with a template that acts as a standard proof for "proven by DNA", separated for atDNA (pretty straight forward, there is already one excellent one and Peter Roberts is good as well), Y-DNA and mtDNA? Don't know what the "gold" standard should be for the last two DNA tests proof though.
+7 votes

Hi Mags,

thanks for your question/post.

Can I suggest that you edit it and specifically mention that you've got your mtDNA test results back? It might confuse other people (it did confuse me in the beginning) as your title is too general (I was assuming you mean an atDNA test as that's what the majority of people takes).

Some comments, thoughts from my side, please correct me if I'm wrong as I'm not an expert on mtDNA.

It seems to me that your haplogroup is very high up the phylotree (same as my mtDNA haplogroup, see my discussion lately on it's respective category). That means I assume your common ancestor (the lady who is the originating mother of that haplogroup) is most likely a couple thousand years ago.

You also mention that 5% of haplogroup H is in the H1b1-T16362c haplogroup. So some quick calculations on the edge of a napkin. Haplogroup H is considered 40% of all mothers in Europe (see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haplogroup_H_(mtDNA)). Europe currently has a population of 742.5 million people (as of 2013). That means there are a minimum of 297 million people with Haplogroup H in Europe alone, I guess we can easily add another 300 million for the rest of the world but let's keep it at 300 million for easier calculation.

5% of that 300 million is 15 million. So you have roughly 15 million if not a lot more people that match you on your mtDNA haplogroup H1b1-T16362c.

It's safe to assume that those with 0 difference are more recent than the couple thousand years (as they also match you in more detailed markers downstream which might not be identified yet as being ancestral).

Still, I don't believe it makes sense to compare family trees and find a needle in a haystack.

For sure those with a difference > 0 don't make any sense. I quote Ian Logan again who's a way more well known expert on mtDNA than anyone else I know:

"I usually suggest an average of 400 years for a HVI1 & HVR2 mutation (also 521-4, 573.1C, 16183-16193) and 1,600 years for a coding region mutation.

So certainly a perfect match can be with all maternal relations in the last 500 years (consider King Richard III and his perfect matches at 'J1c2c3'), or not even match perfectly with one's own mother !"

Also, different than Y-DNA the mutations of mtDNA are much harder to estimate. Sometimes you have none for many generations and I think I read somewhere that someone had 3 (?) in one generation. In general 1 mutation happens every 16 generations (if I interpret Ian's quote correctly) assuming 25 years per generation (400 / 25 = 16).

So in the case you mentioned I assume that you have a paper trail to that common ancestor and both of your have the same mtDNA, right? Only in those cases you can be sure to mark them as proven by DNA.

If you do the reverse (finding a common ancestor with someone who has 0 difference) might be a tough game as you can basically search for 400 years and still might not find a common ancestor (as 400 years is just the average).

I have come to the conclusion that mtDNA test is basically worthless for any conclusion in the genealogical time frame, I rather use atDNA and find a match there through triangulation. Some of my matches must be following the all maternal line (for 5 generations it's 1 of 32, for 6 generations 1 of 64 matches).

But these are just my personal opinion.

 

by Andreas West G2G6 Mach 7 (76.6k points)
Thanks for your post Andreas! I updated the Title to include mtDNA test.

Yes, I have found my direct Maternal line ancestor through Genealocial research and I have found others with my Haplogroup who have found the same Ancestor. When I upgraded to an atDNA test we were able to triangulate our connection. I actually have another cousin waiting in the wings to add her atDNA to the mix to further this too.

Mags
I saw that RJ Horace also was editing your most far female as well, he must have DNA proof as well as far as I remember.

I envy you and others that have so many close relatives in the US, I'm stuck in the old world and all my matches are in single digit cM (genetic distance).

Sigh!
+9 votes
Hello there!  I just got my mt test back and I am also H1b1-T16362C.  This is all new to me at this point, so let me know if I can be of any help while I learn my way around the mt spectrum.
by Skye Sonczalla G2G6 Pilot (105k points)
Hello S D,

Please change your privacy level to "Private with Public Family Tree".  That will allow WikiTree to automatically associate your mtDNA information with your direct maternal line.

If you have not done so already, please upload to MitoSearch and add your MitoSearch ID to your DNA Tests page in WikiTree.

Thanks and sincerely,
Thank you!  I entered in my info via mitosearch: 54THU and updated the info on Wikitree.

Unfortunately I don't have a lot of information on this line: (my furthest known mother of mother ...) http://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Brown-50079

Who wants to try to find an Ann Brown?  Not so easy!!  lol
+4 votes

My mtDNA haplogroup is H1b1-T16362C as well. My earliest  ancestor is from 1650 Normandy, France.

by Joshua Stewart G2G4 (4.9k points)
Hey Joshua - that makes such great sense that your EKA would be in Normandy since this area of France was conquered by the Vikings. In the time since I posted this I have learned a lot about mtDNA and especially about our Haplogroup. It's Scandinavian.

Add this template:
{{Image|file=WikiTree_Images-12.png
|align=l
|size=s
|caption=Full Sequence mtDNA Haplogroup H1b1-T16362C Earliest Known Ancestor.}}

to her profile.

Mags
Ah ok, neat. I have only gotten my results back recently and have found two Viking DNA matches from Sweden, so that makes sense. I’m excited what I will find in the future.

I added that template you suggested, thanks.
+2 votes
Mags be careful of data from MitroDNA.  We saw a case of a Y amtch that showed O and was a com pletely different haplogroup.  Weird results came out of Mitro for several Y tests.  I would stick with FTDNA for Y for MtDNA results.
by Laura Bozzay G2G6 Pilot (843k points)
MitroDNA? https://www.familytreeassistant.com/surnames/Mitro-dna.html?

Do you mean mitoYDNA.org? If mitoYDNA.org, the user self-reports their Haplogroup, it's not something that mitoYDNA calculates, though there is a Haplogroup predictor available on the site.

Mags
The match was for  3 people all of French ancestry to someone in Jamaica named Campbell and there was no link to anyone in common.  And yes Mito Y DNA.  There were several other issues with the matches when I had a geneticist look at it.  for the team.  So our experience was not a good one with that group.

Would love to hear what issues there were? There may not be any link to anyone in common especially for French ancestry, but also because the database is still growing.

3 people all shown to b unrelated in FTDNA Y show up as related with 0 degrees differnce in Mito Y.  All 3 show relatedto Campbell.  A of these people had German French ancestry but lived in USA, France and Russia.
Hello Laura, Would you please share the mitoYDNA IDs of the 3 people?  Thank you.
I need to get their permissiom first
Hey Laura,

I am having trouble making sense of what you are saying. If there is an issue with something at mitoYDNA.org send an email with a description of the issue along with the Kit ID's to info@mitoYDNA.org, please.

Mags

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