Children with same names

Question

Several times in the 1700s and 1800s, parents used the same name for a child when the oldest died.  For example, first child is named John.  This John dies at age 1 yr.  So the next son is named John.  When this happens, is there a proper designation that this is the second John?  In a father and son the same name is designated with Jr and Sr... when it is a sibling, do I say this is John ! and this is John 2?  In some Italian families in the 1800s there are even 3 sons with the same name (the first two died before the 3rd is born).   Maybe there is a designation for this and maybe not. Just asking because it looks odd to have children with the same name. Thanks.

Comments

Followup.... I think there is a boxer (? someone in sports) in recent times that named all his boys after himself and they were all living... I think he included a number with them.  Like Michael I, Michael, II, etc.  But I think that was an eccentricity rather than a proper rule :)

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You're thinking of George Foreman.

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I have several families where this was the case.  And one where there was also a same-name cousin.  I usually put a "should not be confused with" warning at the top of the profile with the other WT-ID#.
If you have sources that show clearly that there were two (or more) children with the same name, it doesn't really look odd to anyone who regularly does this type of research.

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AH!!!!!!   Good to know!!!  The Foreman Grill guy!

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Thanks!! Good idea!

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I've used d.y. as a suffix so that they're not as easily confused by the eyeballs in the sibling lists.

I don't prefer the I and II designations I sometimes see in these cases, because that leaves the surving child with a suffix II that seems out of place when viewed in any other context.

Answer 1

No, Alice, WikiTree does not make any distinction between 2 people with the same name, whether or not they are related.  Of course, it would be very good to mention the existence of brothers with the same name in their respective biographies to avoid confusion.

Comments

Thank you!!!

Answer 2

I don't think it's proper to add a 1 or 2.  I have several occasions that a child dies and the parents use the same name again. The person never used a number after their name.

Comments

As Kevin stated, the profile should not have a number designation UNLESS you have a birth or death source that indicates they used that designation. I have seen it very seldom where it was documented with a number for the later child, when born.

Remember, the name should match the name used in the Sources.

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Numbers as suffixes are not used for English profiles.  Only the US seems to like to use them; in the UK, numbers were only used for the monarchy: George III, Henry VIII and so on.

Of course, if the person themselves used numbers, then you should use them; but if it is just for you so as to differentiate, then WikiTree calls this a 'personal numbering system' and it is not allowed.

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Thank you!!

Answer 3

I have a family that had success with the 3rd child with the same name. I just make sure that the previous children have a DOD recorded. This was common in the 1800s in England.

Comments

Thank you!

Answer 4

I have this occurring in Ireland in various branches and probably most of the time there is no distinction between the first and second child, and for the remaining third they may have been given a middle name, and I’m sure in at least one case they were known by the middle name instead.

Comments

Thank you!

Answer 5

It's common in the Netherlands too. For example, Adriana Bax-70 had four sons named Evert, all of whom died in childhood in the 1850s/60s.

Maaike Biesheuvel-146 had three daughters named Celeke, and three sons named Cornelis Antonie, all born within seven years in the early 1900s. She and her husband also had five stillborn children who were not named. They must have had a tough life.

Comments

Thank you!

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It's totally normal in Hungary, too. I just worked on a side-branch family where they had four each of Ersébet and Susanna; in fact, the only other feminine name they used was Éva, for the third girl when they had triplets.

Given that the explanation I've seen for the practice is that they felt that it allowed the deceased baby to live on, any numbering or other differentiation does not seem appropriate.

Answer 6

Sicily had naming conventions. First male and female child named for the father's parents, Second male and female for the mother's parents. If the one of the children died the next born male or female was still named accordingly. Also if the wife dies and the father remarried and had a daughter, that daughter was named for the deceased 1st wife.

Comments

Great insight! Thanks!