Sir Edward Stradling 2nd Cousin or Great Uncle of Sir John Stradling

Location: St Donats Castle, St. Donats, Glamorgan, Wales
Surname/tag: Stradling

Sir Edward Stradling: 2nd Cousin or Great-Uncle of Sir John Stradling?
This page outlines the genealogical argument for what a centuries old question. Was Sir Edward Stradling (1529-1609) 2nd Cousin or Great-Uncle of his chosen heir, Sir John Stradling Bt (1563-1637)? WT orginally connected the Stradling family in a manner that aligned with "great-uncle"; however, the case for 2nd cousin is vastly more supported by sources either of or near Sir Edward's time.

2nd Cousin Argument

1. Sir Edward was a renowned Welsh scholar, genealogist and antiquarian with a passion for the British language and history of Wales. Page 107 of the 1584 published book, The Historie of Cambria, Now Called Wales: a Part of the Most Famous Yland of Brytaine, by Welsh historian, David Powell, contains the notation at the end of the Stradling pedigree, "collected by Sir Edward Stradling knight" and makes reference to Sir Edward's manuscript "the Winning of Glamorgan". Page 107 also contains the last entry in pedigree as, "Sir Edward Stradling, Knt. that now is married Agnes, second daughter to Sir Edward Gage, of Sussex, Knt. and as yet in the year 1572, hath no issue.".
   1. ITEM: Sir Edward researched and penned his Stradling pedigree by 1572.
   2. ITEM: His pedigree was included in the 1584 book by David Powell.
2. Sir Edward held great admiration for his Stradling family and ancestors, commissioning a commemorative panel for he and Lady Agnes, another panel for his parents and a third panel for his grandparents as a memorial for his family in the Chapel of St. Donat's. His romanticism surrounding Stradling origins likely influenced the outline of the upper generations of his pedigree claims, as reference to the Stradling of St. Donat's lore of the 12th knight attests. However, there was nothing to gain from any misrepresentation of his great uncle, Harry Stradling's, descendants. On page 106 of The Historie of Cambria, regarding Thomas Stradling Esq's 2nd son, Harry Stradling, "Harrie married with the daughter and heir of Thomas Jubb, learned in the lawe, and had issue by hir Francis Stradling, of S. George, by Bristow, yet living.".
   1. ITEM: Sir Edward's pedigree outlines his cousin, Francis, as son of Harry and grandson of Thomas.
   2. ITEM: Francis Stradling is father of, Sir Edward's heir, Sir John Stradling Bt.
3. The original source of signed, sealed, witnessed, and proved will of Sir Edward Stradling V (1529-1609) refers to 4 actual close cousins as "cosen", his niece, Eliazbeth Gage, as "neece", and more distant relations as "kinsman". Throughout the document, he addresses Sir John as "cosen" or "loving cosen" too.
   1. ITEM: Sir Edward addressed every relative in his will with the correct relationship term out as far as 2nd or 3rd cousins, then used "kinsman" for connections beyond.
   2. ITEM: The term "cousin" was indeed more broadly used in the era than the more narrow present-day meaning. However, it does not appear to be the case in Sir Edward's will. As nearly all published bios for Sir Edward mention his scholarly pursuits, with some stating his genealogy efforts too, it should be accepted that such a man purposefully addresses relations in his writings, especially in his last will. Given in his will, he referred to his niece properly as "neece", and all other cousins as "cosen", it should be accepted his reference to Sir John as "cosen" was just as intentional and not the sole use of cousin in some broader usage. If Sir John was his nephew, Sir Edward would have addressed him as such, in the same manner he did for his niece.
4. Regarding Sir John's father, Francis Stradling Esq's parentage, WT had him connected to Unknown Stradling, a placeholder for a potential unknown son of Thomas Stradling MP. This sets up Sir Edward as great-uncle to Sir John. The issue with this is that page 107 of The Historie of Cambria, states of Sir Edward's father, Thomas Stradling MP, "he hath living yet two sonnes, Edward and David" and the commemorative panel for his parents shows 2 other young sons who predeceased Thomas. Lastly, Francis Stradling has 1518 as date of birth on his monumental inscription and Thomas Stradling (current WT profile attached as grandfather of Francis) has c.1495 date of birth.
   1. ITEM: No third male lineage could exist by Thomas Stradling MP for Francis Stradling to have later descended.
   2. ITEM: There is no realistic timeline for an unknown father to exist between Francis and his previously WT-connected grandfather, Thomas Stradling MP.

The following 1584-1963 scholarly bios contain statements of "cousin" and/or parentage of Francis Stradling as being son of Harry.

1. Cokayne, G.E. Complete Baronetage; (Exeter, 1900) Vol.1, p.6-7
2. Collins, Arthur. The Baronettage of England; (London 1720), Vol. I, Pg. 34
3. Griffiths, Ralph. The Rise of the Stradlings of St. Donat's, (1963) Vol. 7; p.47
4. Nicholas, Thomas. Annals and Antiquities of the Counties and the County Families of Wales; (London, 1872) p.562
5. Powell, David. The Historie of Cambria, Now Called Wales: a Part of the Most Famous Yland of Brytaine (1584) pp.106-107
6. Traherne, John Montgomery. Stradling Correspondence: A Series of Letters Written in the Reign of Queen Elizabeth; (London, 1840) p.xiii, xxi, xxii
7. Williams, Rev. Robert M.A. A Biographical Dictionary of Eminent Welshmen (London, 1852) p.475
8. Williams, W.R. The Parliamentary History of the Principality of Wales; (Brecknock, 1895) p.97
9. Wotton, Thomas. The English Baronets: Being a Genealogical and Historical Account of Their Families (London, 1727) p.7
10. Jones, Evan David. National Library of Wales: Dictionary of Welsh Biography (1959); STRADLING family of Glamorganshire

Great-Uncle Argument

1. John Stradling's Epigrammatum Libri Quatuor (1607) has several epigrams to Sir Edward Stradling. Book 1: Epigram 8 refers to Sir Edward as "his uncle" and Book 4: Epigram 123 refers to Sir Edward as "the poet's most dear uncle".
2. Sir Edward Stradling was married to Agnes Gage, brother of Edward Gage and Sir John Stradling Bt was married to Eliazbeth Gage, daughter of Edward Gage.
   1. ITEM: Sir John refers to Sir Edward as "uncle" in his first and again in his last of several epigrams to his predecessor. As heir of Sir Edward, Sir John's usage of "uncle" would be a more respectful address than "cousin" for a man of Sir Edward's status, and by Sir John's marriage to Elizabeth Gage, Lady Agnes' niece, Sir Edward is indeed Sir John's uncle too, albeit "in-law", not familial and not great-uncle.
3. No original sources for "great-uncle" have been found.

The following bios contain statements of great-nephew or great-uncle.

1. Wikisource contributors, "Dictionary of National Biography, 1885-1900/Stradling, Edward," Wikisource
2. History of Parliament online: STRADLING, Sir John, 1st Bt. (1563-1637), of St. Donat's Castle, Glam.
   1. ITEM: Although much of this bio is well-researched, there remain errant statements in some areas... Sir John was Francis Stradling's fourth son, not first son... Sir John's mother was not Mary (Mitchell) Stradling, rather Elizabeth (Mitchell) Stradling, sister to Lady Jane (Mitchell) Portman. This is as per Sir John's own published epigram to his parents, Book 1: Epigram #54 entitled "For Francis Stradling his Father and Elizabeth his mother, most dear to him, buried in the same tomb".

Conclusions

Given Sir Edward penned the Stradling pedigree by 1572, stating Francis as son of Harry, Sir John's usage of "uncle" is better explained by his wife being niece to Lady Agnes/Sir Edward, and Sir Edward addressing Sir John only as "cosen" multiple times, along with 4 other cousins in his will, the following is concluded.
Gilbert-13209 17:24, 6 February 2021 (UTC)

1. Sir John Stradling Bt is son of Francis Stradling Esq, son of Harry Stradling, son of Thomas Stradling Esq, making Sir John actually 2nd cousins with Edward Stradling, as per Sir Edward's own self-researched pedigree reflects.
2. Francis Stradling Esq has been disconnected from Thomas Stradling MP and connected as son of Harry Stradling in WikiTree, thereby shifting Francis' descendants, including Sir John Stradling Bt.
3. Unknown Stradling was a placeholder profile and has been disconnected from Thomas Stradling MP.

This outcome restores the Stradling lineage with proper alignment of the decendants of Thomas Stradling Esq.